Plan B » Deadly Attacks in Paris

danyi · 11/16/2015 4:22 pm

Caribou wrote:
needtosay wrote:
Caribou wrote:
Need, not sure if you're talking to me but I was referring to him telling GS yesterday morning that ISIS is contained. Maybe it's not denial, maybe it's him making light of the situation to make himself look better. Who knows with him.
As far as Benghazi, he was still denying terrorism well after he knew the truth.

I don't think Obama is in denial about ISIS nor do I think he is making light of of the situation. Like I said he is one of a handlful of country leaders who has taken action against ISIS. Our country under Obama has been active in trying to do something about ISIS. What is it you expect him to do about ISIS?

What has he done?

Over the last 15 months, the US has conducted the majority of over 8,500 airstrikes on ISIS, committed over 3,500 troops to Iraq, and recently committed 50 special operations soldiers to the area. I think it dis-honors our military when we don't acknowledge what they our doing over there.

The only thing left to do is put substantial amount of ground troops into the area and fight a ground war. Here is the problem: Who is going to go in those areas and IF they are successful in driving ISIS out, Who is going to stay in all those areas to keep ISIS from returning? The lesson of Iraq is that when you take dictators out and there is not a strong government in place, terrorist will move in. Currently, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria all have either weak or no governance. We can also add Yemen to the weak government, therefore a hotbed for terrorists as well.

So, who is going to place ground troops in the above countries, and who is going to prop up all those governments should they be successful in driving out the terrorists?

Last edited by danyi (11/16/2015 8:18 pm)

needtosay · 11/16/2015 6:57 pm

Thank you dany. Obama has done much more than people are willing to give him credit for.

danyi · 11/16/2015 8:04 pm

"Thank you dany. Obama has done much more than people are willing to give him credit for."

People are free to disagree with Obama's strategy, but suggesting that our military are not highly involved in that region is disingenuous in my opinion.

You'll notice that the "R" presidential candidates all say we should be doing more, but when faced with the question of committing significant ground forces, they refuse to answer. It's because that it is the only option left. They know the American people are highly dubious of sending troops into another quagmire in the middle east. I agree with the majority of Americans as I don't want to see anymore lives committed to a region that has been in turmoil for decades. It's time for the people that live in that region to solve their own problems. We will just be seen as foreign invaders.

Last edited by danyi (11/16/2015 8:06 pm)

Braveone99 · 11/18/2015 12:21 pm

AdminShiny wrote:
Campbell85255 wrote:
Nice timing, Obama…….. This morning on GMA Obama declared that ISIS is contained and he feels they're not gaining strength. The shooters shouted "Allahu Akbar," and a suspect the police captured confirmed it was ISIS, but Obama doesn't want to speculate what the motives are of the guys yelling "Allahu Akabar" as they execute innocents. Obama called the violence "an attack on all of humanity and the universal values we share."

Here's the thing, Sherlock……….Islamic extremists don't share our values. Obama can condemn these "random acts of violence" ad infinitum, but until we address the root of the problem…..radical Islam…….nothing is ever going to be accomplished. Wake up, Obama. Ditch the PC nonsense and address the root of the problem already.
My goodness Caribou, the bodies are barely cold and it's already being used as a political football. How disrespectful.

I am so disgusted by the right. After every mass shooting they decry the left for "politicizing" the shootings re: gun control. Yet any time there is an act of terrorism around the world, the right does the EXACT same thing by screaming that refugees are all terrorists and that Obama doesn't take ISIS seriously and it's all his fault. Give me a break.

When they speculated on Benghazi they were jumped on and an investigation to the tune of 5 million dollars plus is still ongoing. But they are cautious this time and are also pounced on for lying to the public or being naive. Do you guys hear yourselves?

Obama was talking about the advancement of ISIS into other areas, and the fact that Sinjar had been retaken so the forward progress was contained. But I'm sure this soundbite will be beaten to death by the right in an effort to paint Obama as stupid and all refugees, be they men, women or children, as possible threats and people to fear. Fox News will have a hey day with little regard for the victims.

If there was ever a time for solidarity, unity and joining together in a time of grief, this is it.

Let's be human beings for a few minutes, can we?

Very well said Shiny!!! If Caribou, or others, took the time to research exactly what Obama said they would realize his 'contained' comment related to the advancement of ISIS into other areas where they train, keep weapons, recruit etc..

It is time to stop the hate against Obama and stand together in partnership to support the fight against terrorism around the world.

zeke · 11/18/2015 12:37 pm

Yes....so agree, Braveone. We must get together and back up our leader otherwise we look foolish to the rest of the world. We as a nation will suffer for that.

Caribou · 11/18/2015 6:40 pm

Braveone99 wrote:
AdminShiny wrote:
Campbell85255 wrote:
Nice timing, Obama…….. This morning on GMA Obama declared that ISIS is contained and he feels they're not gaining strength. The shooters shouted "Allahu Akbar," and a suspect the police captured confirmed it was ISIS, but Obama doesn't want to speculate what the motives are of the guys yelling "Allahu Akabar" as they execute innocents. Obama called the violence "an attack on all of humanity and the universal values we share."

Here's the thing, Sherlock……….Islamic extremists don't share our values. Obama can condemn these "random acts of violence" ad infinitum, but until we address the root of the problem…..radical Islam…….nothing is ever going to be accomplished. Wake up, Obama. Ditch the PC nonsense and address the root of the problem already.
My goodness Caribou, the bodies are barely cold and it's already being used as a political football. How disrespectful.

I am so disgusted by the right. After every mass shooting they decry the left for "politicizing" the shootings re: gun control. Yet any time there is an act of terrorism around the world, the right does the EXACT same thing by screaming that refugees are all terrorists and that Obama doesn't take ISIS seriously and it's all his fault. Give me a break.

When they speculated on Benghazi they were jumped on and an investigation to the tune of 5 million dollars plus is still ongoing. But they are cautious this time and are also pounced on for lying to the public or being naive. Do you guys hear yourselves?

Obama was talking about the advancement of ISIS into other areas, and the fact that Sinjar had been retaken so the forward progress was contained. But I'm sure this soundbite will be beaten to death by the right in an effort to paint Obama as stupid and all refugees, be they men, women or children, as possible threats and people to fear. Fox News will have a hey day with little regard for the victims.

If there was ever a time for solidarity, unity and joining together in a time of grief, this is it.

Let's be human beings for a few minutes, can we?
Very well said Shiny!!! If Caribou, or others, took the time to research exactly what Obama said they would realize his 'contained' comment related to the advancement of ISIS into other areas where they train, keep weapons, recruit etc..

It is time to stop the hate against Obama and stand together in partnership to support the fight against terrorism around the world.

Actually Braveone, I didn't have to do research, I read the transcript of the interview Obama did. Obama's comments are false. "From the start, our goal has been first to contain, and we have contained them." Saying this was his downfall. If we aren't seeing the 'systematic march by ISIL across Syria' then why aren't we sending the Syrian refugees back home? It doesn't matter how much his fans try to explain his comments, he clearly was trying to downplay the severity if the threat of ISIS. Unfortunately for him, they struck within a few hours of his naïve comments.

Right now, Obama is looking foolish to the rest of the world all on his own without the help of Americans.

Teachesk · 11/18/2015 9:30 pm

Caribou wrote:
Braveone99 wrote:
AdminShiny wrote:

My goodness Caribou, the bodies are barely cold and it's already being used as a political football. How disrespectful.

I am so disgusted by the right. After every mass shooting they decry the left for "politicizing" the shootings re: gun control. Yet any time there is an act of terrorism around the world, the right does the EXACT same thing by screaming that refugees are all terrorists and that Obama doesn't take ISIS seriously and it's all his fault. Give me a break.

When they speculated on Benghazi they were jumped on and an investigation to the tune of 5 million dollars plus is still ongoing. But they are cautious this time and are also pounced on for lying to the public or being naive. Do you guys hear yourselves?

Obama was talking about the advancement of ISIS into other areas, and the fact that Sinjar had been retaken so the forward progress was contained. But I'm sure this soundbite will be beaten to death by the right in an effort to paint Obama as stupid and all refugees, be they men, women or children, as possible threats and people to fear. Fox News will have a hey day with little regard for the victims.

If there was ever a time for solidarity, unity and joining together in a time of grief, this is it.

Let's be human beings for a few minutes, can we?
Very well said Shiny!!! If Caribou, or others, took the time to research exactly what Obama said they would realize his 'contained' comment related to the advancement of ISIS into other areas where they train, keep weapons, recruit etc..

It is time to stop the hate against Obama and stand together in partnership to support the fight against terrorism around the world.
Actually Braveone, I didn't have to do research, I read the transcript of the interview Obama did. Obama's comments are false. "From the start, our goal has been first to contain, and we have contained them." Saying this was his downfall. If we aren't seeing the 'systematic march by ISIL across Syria' then why aren't we sending the Syrian refugees back home? It doesn't matter how much his fans try to explain his comments, he clearly was trying to downplay the severity if the threat of ISIS. Unfortunately for him, they struck within a few hours of his naïve comments.

Right now, Obama is looking foolish to the rest of the world all on his own without the help of Americans.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nope.....the only ones looking foolish to world are the republicans with their no refugee's in my state speeches. France, however, is a shinning example of not letting ISIS fill them with hate. GOP looking weak and ignorant IMHO

AdminShiny · 11/18/2015 9:39 pm

Caribou wrote:
Braveone99 wrote:
AdminShiny wrote:
My goodness Caribou, the bodies are barely cold and it's already being used as a political football. How disrespectful.

I am so disgusted by the right. After every mass shooting they decry the left for "politicizing" the shootings re: gun control. Yet any time there is an act of terrorism around the world, the right does the EXACT same thing by screaming that refugees are all terrorists and that Obama doesn't take ISIS seriously and it's all his fault. Give me a break.

When they speculated on Benghazi they were jumped on and an investigation to the tune of 5 million dollars plus is still ongoing. But they are cautious this time and are also pounced on for lying to the public or being naive. Do you guys hear yourselves?

Obama was talking about the advancement of ISIS into other areas, and the fact that Sinjar had been retaken so the forward progress was contained. But I'm sure this soundbite will be beaten to death by the right in an effort to paint Obama as stupid and all refugees, be they men, women or children, as possible threats and people to fear. Fox News will have a hey day with little regard for the victims.

If there was ever a time for solidarity, unity and joining together in a time of grief, this is it.

Let's be human beings for a few minutes, can we?
Very well said Shiny!!! If Caribou, or others, took the time to research exactly what Obama said they would realize his 'contained' comment related to the advancement of ISIS into other areas where they train, keep weapons, recruit etc..

It is time to stop the hate against Obama and stand together in partnership to support the fight against terrorism around the world.
Actually Braveone, I didn't have to do research, I read the transcript of the interview Obama did. Obama's comments are false. "From the start, our goal has been first to contain, and we have contained them." Saying this was his downfall. If we aren't seeing the 'systematic march by ISIL across Syria' then why aren't we sending the Syrian refugees back home? It doesn't matter how much his fans try to explain his comments, he clearly was trying to downplay the severity if the threat of ISIS. Unfortunately for him, they struck within a few hours of his naïve comments.

Right now, Obama is looking foolish to the rest of the world all on his own without the help of Americans.

Obama looks foolish to no one. The only ones who are trying to twist his words to indicate that he somehow suggested that terrorism was contained are the Republicans in America. I see not one international article mentioned on any of the sites or message boards I frequent. Everyone is talking about how ugly and cowardly it is to see some in America trying to turn away refugees while France, the very country that was just attacked, is resolving to take 30,000 refugees.

It is clear that Obama was referring to Sinjar being retaken and ISIS no longer advancing forward, He didn't say anything about acts of terrorism being contained or stopped. It's quite a stretch but I don't think anyone outside of the GOP is interested in spin right now.

Everyone else is worried about how we can help the refugees.

DollyLongstaff · 11/19/2015 9:08 pm

Needtosay posted:
Obama has done much more than people are willing to give him credit for.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Caribou wrote:
What has he done?

*********************************************************************************************************
While Republicans were busy being adult crybabies over how Obama is helping ISIS destroy the world, Obama killed two ISIS leaders and they said not a word about it.

Last edited by DollyLongstaff (11/20/2015 1:50 pm)

DollyLongstaff · 11/20/2015 1:01 pm

Caribou wrote:
Dolly, I don't believe anyone is blaming Obama for what ISIS did in Paris.

Really?
Fiorina blames Obama and Clinton in part for terrorist attacks in Paris.

Carly Fiorina says the terrorist attacks in Paris are a direct consequence of President Barack Obama and his administration's foreign policy decisions.

Rick Santorum:Former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum is using the terrorist attacks in Paris to criticize Hillary Rodham Clinton and President Barack Obama.Santorum says on Saturday that the Islamic State group is a creation of the foreign policy decisions of Clinton and Obama.Santorum is speaking at a presidential candidate event organized by the Florida Republican Party. He says America will stand with France and pray for the country. He then adds, "and if we had better leadership, help them."(US News and World Report)

President Obama is to blame for the Paris terrorist attacks, according to Barry Sternlicht, CEO of Starwood Capital Group.Sternlicht told Bloomberg that Obama underestimated the threat posed by ISIS. "This is the president's fault what happened in Paris," he said.

On Fox, Glenn Beck Blames Obama For Paris AttacksBeck: "All Of The Decisions That The President Has Championed" Led Us To Paris Attacks.

On their official Facebook page on Saturday, Fox News gave various updates on the story, and their fans sounded off on President Obama.

"Obama is responsible for this. I hope Paris understands this, and cares.

Tucker Carlson on Fox and Friends Saturday, mere hours after the Paris attacks, supported the idea that Obama’s apparent rejection of the American Constitution was an important factor in the Paris massacre.

Last edited by DollyLongstaff (11/20/2015 4:45 pm)

Braveone99 · 11/20/2015 3:05 pm

Caribou wrote:
Braveone99 wrote:
AdminShiny wrote:

My goodness Caribou, the bodies are barely cold and it's already being used as a political football. How disrespectful.

I am so disgusted by the right. After every mass shooting they decry the left for "politicizing" the shootings re: gun control. Yet any time there is an act of terrorism around the world, the right does the EXACT same thing by screaming that refugees are all terrorists and that Obama doesn't take ISIS seriously and it's all his fault. Give me a break.

When they speculated on Benghazi they were jumped on and an investigation to the tune of 5 million dollars plus is still ongoing. But they are cautious this time and are also pounced on for lying to the public or being naive. Do you guys hear yourselves?

Obama was talking about the advancement of ISIS into other areas, and the fact that Sinjar had been retaken so the forward progress was contained. But I'm sure this soundbite will be beaten to death by the right in an effort to paint Obama as stupid and all refugees, be they men, women or children, as possible threats and people to fear. Fox News will have a hey day with little regard for the victims.

If there was ever a time for solidarity, unity and joining together in a time of grief, this is it.

Let's be human beings for a few minutes, can we?
Very well said Shiny!!! If Caribou, or others, took the time to research exactly what Obama said they would realize his 'contained' comment related to the advancement of ISIS into other areas where they train, keep weapons, recruit etc..

It is time to stop the hate against Obama and stand together in partnership to support the fight against terrorism around the world.
Actually Braveone, I didn't have to do research, I read the transcript of the interview Obama did. Obama's comments are false. "From the start, our goal has been first to contain, and we have contained them." Saying this was his downfall. If we aren't seeing the 'systematic march by ISIL across Syria' then why aren't we sending the Syrian refugees back home? It doesn't matter how much his fans try to explain his comments, he clearly was trying to downplay the severity if the threat of ISIS. Unfortunately for him, they struck within a few hours of his naïve comments.

Right now, Obama is looking foolish to the rest of the world all on his own without the help of Americans.

Actually Caribou if you read the transcript of the Obama interview, with comprehension, his comments were indeed true. Very specifically, the geographic expansion of ISIS in Northern Iraq and Northern Syria has been stopped and significant amounts of territory have been taken back.

It is actually quite clear that when Obama says ISIS is contained, he is talking about ISIS's territorial expansion in Syria and Iraq. He was not saying that ISIS no longer presents a threat and acknowledged that ISIS may have surpassed al-Qaida as the greatest terror threat in the world.

Obama is accurate when he says ISIS hasn't gained territory in Iraq and Syria in recent months, though it does not give a full picture of ISIS's global reach. He did not rule out the potential for a terrorist attack, and also made it clear that the US anti-terrorist efforts are ongoing.

Pay better attention Caribou and for goodness sake, stop bashing the POTUS!!!

Caribou · 11/20/2015 7:57 pm

Braveone, I would love to continue this debate, however I prefer it without insults.

Braveone99 · 11/20/2015 9:35 pm

Caribou wrote:
Braveone, I would love to continue this debate, however I prefer it without insults.

Insults? Apparently you are unable to compose a convincing argument and instead claim insult. If you're not confident enough in what you say or open to an opposing point of view free of belligerence you deserve to be ignored.

zeke · 11/21/2015 1:49 pm

Based on personal conversations I know that many Europeans are sickened by the continual opposition to this President by the Republicans. Only Americans will suffer from this negative perception by the rest of the world.

Sam · 11/21/2015 2:33 pm

Great post Braveone. I saw no insults either. That was the beauty of your response...all fact no name calling. What you said about comprehension is not an insult, it is the truth. It is a very serioius time right now & people need to get their facts straight. President Obama is respected on a global level. He has repaired a lot of the damage that the Bush administration did to our country on that global level.

It is kind of scary that our country is so divided over ISIS. It is ridiculous that some Americans mock the President the elected leader of our country. I never cared for Bush's policy but I never disrespected his leadership. I just think it is wrong to discredit & insult our President. Most of the people who do this do not even really understand what is going on with ISIS, how it was created & the way it is fueled. Heck, I would say very few of us really understand. I feel like many of the people working for ISIS have experienced destruction of their homes, family, life, caused by our bombing of their country (Iraq, Afganistan, Libya....) and they view us as the terrorists. I think it all has to do with your persective as to who & what a terrorist is. Imagine if our country were bombed & our families & life destroyed. Imagine the hatred you would have for the people who did this.

So to me, these people who think they are "true Americans", "Patriots" or whatever glorified name they choose, are actually hurting the country they so claim to love by hating on the POTUS. It makes us look weak to ISIS. That is how they work. The manipulate their enemies weakness. As a country we need to stick together & work together to find a solution.

Last edited by Sam (11/21/2015 2:35 pm)

Braveone99 · 11/22/2015 11:44 am

Sam wrote:
Great post Braveone. I saw no insults either. That was the beauty of your response...all fact no name calling. What you said about comprehension is not an insult, it is the truth. It is a very serioius time right now & people need to get their facts straight. President Obama is respected on a global level. He has repaired a lot of the damage that the Bush administration did to our country on that global level.

It is kind of scary that our country is so divided over ISIS. It is ridiculous that some Americans mock the President the elected leader of our country. I never cared for Bush's policy but I never disrespected his leadership. I just think it is wrong to discredit & insult our President. Most of the people who do this do not even really understand what is going on with ISIS, how it was created & the way it is fueled. Heck, I would say very few of us really understand. I feel like many of the people working for ISIS have experienced destruction of their homes, family, life, caused by our bombing of their country (Iraq, Afganistan, Libya....) and they view us as the terrorists. I think it all has to do with your persective as to who & what a terrorist is. Imagine if our country were bombed & our families & life destroyed. Imagine the hatred you would have for the people who did this.

So to me, these people who think they are "true Americans", "Patriots" or whatever glorified name they choose, are actually hurting the country they so claim to love by hating on the POTUS. It makes us look weak to ISIS. That is how they work. The manipulate their enemies weakness. As a country we need to stick together & work together to find a solution.

Very true Sam!!